Forrest Lien


Forrest Lien





Forrest R. Lien, LCSW, ACSW, is a clinical social worker. He has long been the clinical director of the Institute for Attachment and Child Development (IACD) in Evergreen, Colorado. The IACD is still better known by its earlier name: the Attachment Center at Evergreen, the leader in Attachment (Holding) Therapy, founded by Foster Cline, MD. IACD has trained therapist in Attachment Therapy, rented out treatment rooms to Attachment Therapists, and offered in-home therapy. Lien also maintains a private practice in Littleton, Colorado, with Margaret Meinecke, LCSW, called FRL Counseling and Associates, which also provides training.

Lien attended graduated with an MSW from University of Nebraska Graduate School of Social Work in 1983; he trained at Casey Family Program in Tucson, Arizona; and in 1995, he joined the Attachment Center at Evergreen. Lien states he was also trained in Attachment Therapy by Priscilla Misner of Esperero Counseling and by Lani Tolman of The Family Attachment Institute.  Lien advertises that he is a “Certifed Provider for Advanced Brain Tecnologies” [sic].

Lien claims to have presented “over 100 workshops internationally on Attachment Disorder” and to have “consulted” with numerous television programs regarding child abuse issues.
In September 2009, Lien was placed on probation by Colorado Board of Social Work Examiners; he was ordered to take additional education courses and be supervised by a practice monitor. (Four months later, John Alston, MD, the psychiatrist serving ACE/IACD, was also disciplined regarding children brought to Colorado for “intensive” therapy.)

Lien has worked with numerous well-known Attachment Therapists, including Connell Watkins and Neil Feinberg, both of whom have permanently lost their ability to legally practice in Colorado.

Lien wrote a description of Attachment Therapy (“Corrective Attachment Therapy”) which was submitted for evaluation, along with other various mental health practices, by the National Crime Victims Research and Treatment Center. Attachment Therapy alone was given the lowest ranking, i.e. “concerning treatment.” These therapy evaluations were
published in 2003 by the US Department of Justice, in which is it stated that, “Practitioners should refrain from using experimental, concerning, or potentially dangerous treatments.”



In His Own Words


— Most Telling —

  • [I]n any kind of trauma resolution, what are we trying to accomplish? Create the ordeal of the trauma to resolve the trauma… – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives,” presentation by Forrest R. Lien, LCSW, Clinical Director/Therapist, The Institute for Attachment and Child Development, Birmingham, Alabama, January 14, 2005.




  • I do therapy in my lap. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”


  • What [the audience member] is saying is what you’re talking about goes against everything I’ve learned about how to treat kids. Exactly, folks. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • I say, “We do therapy a little different here in Colorado.” … “Hop up.” Kid hops up in my lap. …He’s laid across my lap…I’m not holding him down….He’s scared. What’s he scared of? He’s scared I’m going to hurt him? Perhaps. But I think what he’s mostly scared of is I’m going to have his number. …[H]e’s saying he wants to do it my way. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • I've had a passion for this work…. I'm very proud of the work that we do at the Institute.  – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • They hate how controlling I can be…. Discipline and control equals [sic] love and nurture. So they go in this [“therapeutic foster”] home. And they see a pretty bossy lady in the beginning. They think she’s the Wicked Witch of the North. And I’m the Wicked Therapist of the North. Because we’re so bossy. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • Now the parent’s behind the one-way mirror who’s been abused and battered by these kids. You’ve got to be careful. Because if they’re sitting back there going, “Yes! Yes! You know, go after him!…Get him, therapist! Go get that kid!” …But at the same time, we want them to feel empowered. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.

  • Welcome to the war zone! … So what we’re asking these kids to do -- give it up to be vulnerable again….To them, they think they’ll die. That’s the war zone for families. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • [W]e’re successful. Eight-two percent of our treatment population – and we get the most severe kids in this area – go home in two weeks. The other 18 percent are more severe that need extended care. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • If I pull a kid into an interview, he’s not going to give me the symptoms. Now if I put him on my lap, I’m going to see some symptoms. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • How’s he feeling after that therapy session? Probably kind of scared, emotionally upset. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • So kids end up raging, little terrors in the house. And it pushes the parent into being punative. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • Can I treat an Attachment Disordered kid if I don’t address their biochemical imbalance? Can’t. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • The really bright kids, they go, “Okay. I think I’ve figured it out. I think I know how to do it Konnie’s way. Or do it Forrest’s way.” You know, I don’t care whether it’s genuine or not. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • In the beginning, they’re scared, because they don’t like control, right? – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • If we want any sanity, we have to lock our kids up. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • These kids like to wander around at night and stalk their prey. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • Prison. That’s where they’re headed. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”


Holding Therapy —

  • The problem is, because the Institute, it's been around for 33 years, there's never been a child hurt in therapy.  – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • Primarily five to 18. But the oldest I’ve treated was 56. Held a 56 year old Marine Corp drill sergeant in my lap once. And that’s a story I’d be proud to tell you. He’s not too proud....What was the contract with him? …[His wife] said to him, “You get in Forrest’s lap, or I’m out of the marriage.” That was his contract. And when that guy’s life unfolded, the fear-based rage that was inside that guy went back to the one-year-old age… I had two of my biggest colleagues with me on that one. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • [W]ith little ones, like a toddler…His rage is his primitive survival. So I have to train parents how to hold kids through their rages. And you can turn them around in a couple of days. But it may take hours of raging before the kid gives it up to relax in your arms. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • [A] lot of times I need the juvenile system to align with me with a contract… It’s this 18-year-old kid who’s still in the custody of the State of California Correction… Our first day of contracting is: “Are you going to do it Forrest’s way or not? And if you don’t, this sheriff will just turn around and go back to California with you and lock you up.” Of course he’s going to agree to that…. Jumps up in my lap. And I’m a little nervous. And his body starts to tighten up….[His] adopted parents with me, who he really does care about. And his body starts to get tense. He says, “I don’t like this.” .…Now about the third day, he’d about had enough of this. He says, “I don’t like this kind of therapy. I think this is faggy…” And I said, “Sad for you. Guess the contract’s over.” – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • Holding Therapy is done with the consent of the child. IACD uses an across the lap, developmentally appropriate, nurturing posture for the purpose of facilitating the safe expression of feelings and processing of traumatic events and/or memories. – “Controversary/Confusion About Treatment Methods,” Institute for Attachment and Child Development. [captured 6 Aug 2007; accessed 12/28/2011]


— Clip of Holding Therapy —

  • LIEN: I’m going to show you some video clips. A two-week intensive is about 30 to 35 hours of therapy. I’m going to show you about 15 minutes.... KONNIE STOLTZ [co-therapist]: Brandon was a riot. He was one of the most concrete thinkers I think I’ve ever seen…. This whiny, whimpy little kid. LIEN: He was actually entertaining.We did a lot of cross talk with him…While this kid’s over here trying to figure out what to do, because we just ignore his behavior, and he’s just getting all wacked out, saying, “Okay, do I need to do a jumping jack? Or what do I need to do?” ... LIEN: So the clip I’m going to show you. We’re going to do a little work around [birth mother] Mom Barb....And what I’m going to demonstrate for him is that your mom has control of your heart and your head... saying, “You can’t get her out. You’re going to be just like her.” ....“Looks like you’re scared right now. I’d like you to put words to what your body’s telling me.” Mad, sad, glad, scared. It’s the only four feelings we ask of these kids, because feelings they don’t understand….You can put just about every feeling there is in those four. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives,” (2006).


— “Attachment Disorder” —

  • What personality fills our prisons today?  Don't trust. “I'm a survivor.  Take what I want.  And I don't care what you want.  The world evolves [sic] around me.” – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • They don't respond to the same stimuli as normal children do. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • [T]oday you're going to find how [these adoptive parents] became pawns to these kids. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • The context of how people do relationships.  And why these kids don't know how to do it from here [points to sternum].   They learn how to do it from here. [points to head] – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • An adult attachment disorder personality is really what anti-social is. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • [W]ith attachment disordered kids – they’re very grandiose, self-centered. “You can’t tell me nothing.” – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • Bipolar kids…they love to fight. They love to win the fight. And the same way with attachment disordered kids. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • [A]ttachment disordered kids…they chose when they want to be irritable.
  • [W]e found the right medicine, and they’re doing well, and they go home, and the hometown doc takes them off all those medicine and says, “I don’t agree with this.” And then the symptoms come back. And who pays the price for that? The family. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • Attachment disordered kids always feel entitled and want the world to evolve [sic] around them. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”


— Diagnosing Attachment Disorder —

  • There is a continuum of severity for Attachment Disorders. One way of determining severity is using the RADQ (Randolph Attachment Disorder Questionnaire). If your therapist does not have that assessment tool you can contact our Institute to have an assessment done. – “Ask the Therapist,” Little Prince website. [captured 11 Dec 2004; accessed 3/14/09]


— Conflating “Attachment Disorder” with RAD —

  • Attachment Disorder or Reactive Attachment Disorder, as it's called in the DSM, is a disorder where the symptoms are manifested out of close/intimate relationships primarily with the maternal figure. – “Ask the Therapist,” Little Prince website. [captured 11 Dec 2004; accessed 3/14/09]
— Attitudes Toward Children —

  • “I’m empathic about your life. I think it sucks.” – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • This isn’t nice therapy to make them feel nice. No pain, no gain… Who’s fault is that. I wasn’t theirs when it started. It is their fault now. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”


— Alarms —

  • [W]e do put circuit-breaker alarms on the doors… – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”


— Dismissing Birth Parents —

  • Say ‘goodbye’ to your parents and move on.” – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • I’m going to show you a tape about telling a kid about his birth mom. Because don’t you have to say goodbye to say hello. The problem is these kids grow up, turning out just like their birth parents even when they don’t live with them. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • I’ll put up on the wall the legacies: “Your dad was a drug dealer. He was a sex addict. He was an alcoholic.”… “Kid: thief, liar, con artist.” …What he’s going to be like as a parent: “You WILL abuse your children. You WILL hurt your kids.” – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • “So you have a choice, John. You can choose to work hard to change that…Or you’re going to pass this on and hurt your kids, too. What are you going to do? Are you going to work our program and try to get better and heal your heart? Or are you going to honor your [birth] dad?” Now isn’t that a conflict for them? – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”


— Psychodrama —

We do role plays. So we re-enact some part of their early history with their birth parents. So we bring in interns or therapists that do role plays of birth parents. And those role plays are very intense. And that role play may be in my lap, with another therapist next to me. And I’m contracting the kid, saying, “Today we’re going through another step of what it was like to live…in your birth family. And it’s going to be scary and it’s going to hard for you.”…

“Do we really have to do this, Forrest?”

“Yup, because you’re pretty locked into the old way of doing things.”

So we do a role play… Let’s say we have that abusive, alcoholic dad. Big therapist. Male intern of mine comes… that role player will splash whiskey on his face and his breath…We’ve already read the history. Knows what I’m talking about. He’s in my lap. Kurt walks in. His body goes into scared… His body remembers the trauma. So role players are coming in. And kind of talking drunk. “What are you doing with my kid? You got to discipline this kid by yanking him around and hurting him…Now this kids kind of cowering in my arms. What’s the feelings going on?

“I’m scared.”

“And what are you scared of?”

“I’m scared he’s going to hurt me.”

“I won’t let him hurt you.”

“What the feeling?”

“I’m afraid he’s still going to hurt me.”

And then the mother’s there. And she’s the battered mother. And the role player’s [Lien pounds his fist into his other hand] making the noises about hitting her. That’s triggering another feeling for him, because he was around that abuse.

And he’s cowering again. And I’m saying, “Can you tell dad how you’re feeling?” …And I said, “They have control of your life. They control everything about you. Still. And they don’t even live with you.”…And we keep pushing the intensity of the role play. Dad’s getting LOUDER! He’s getting more obnoxious! He’s talking about beating up mom and the kid! And I’ll say, “What are you going to do?”

“I don’t know.”

“Who can help you.”

“I don’t know.”

“Well, who do you think can help you in your life? Who do you trust that can help you?”

“Mom and dad.”

“Which mom and dad?”

“My mom and dad behind the one-way mirror.”
 – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

— Treatment Families —

  • Our treatment families are the key to our program, because our treatment families have been in your shoes…. They move to Colorado and make it their profession. That’s who we have doing treatment. I’ll match them up with any therapist in this room as far as their clinical ability to understand symptoms in these kids… – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.” – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • So this kid’s going to Konnie’s [Konnie Stoltz], and he’s anxious. And Konnie’s saying, “Okay, you’re going to do it my way.”…She’s pretty bossy. But she’s not bossy in an angry way. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.” – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • So they’re coming to our family treatment program, 24/7 in the developmental box of infancy and toddlerhood… And you’re thinking, “How do you do that with a teenager?” – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • In Colorado, if you have a runner…We put them at Connie’s house or Jackie’s house because they live in the mountains. If you run away in the mountains, you’re putting your life at risk…. “If you run in Colorado, you’re prey to predators.” What a contradiction in terms there. I mean, these kids like to prey on others. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • Now why do we have kids leave their forever parents during treatment? Because isn’t that kind of a contradiction of attachment? A lot of people ask that question…. By separating them, can we measure their conflict about not being with their parents? We can measure how much attachment they have or don’t have. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • So he goes to Konnie’s …and the kid doesn’t want to listen. She gets on the horn and says, “Forrest, I don’t think Johnny’s interested in the program.” And, you know, she’s cross-talking with me over the phone… “Maybe tomorrow in therapy you might want to let his parents know that maybe this isn’t going to work. And maybe they need to go home or take care of themselves.” While the kid’s ears are this big. And the kid’s, “That’s not what I want! I want to go home with my family.” – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • And mom and dad have a smile on their face. And they’re going for a nice dinner in the mountains. And they’re going for a hike. And the kid says, “Can I go with you?” “Oh, sweetheart, I would love it if you went with us. Looks like you’re not ready. Are you doing a good job at Mom Konnie’s house?” “No, Mom.” [dejected voice] “Oh, I’m so sad for you, sweetheard. But I’m still looking forward to spending alone time with Daddy.” … Now the kids owns the conflict. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”


— Contracting and Threats of Abandonment —

  • Contracting with these kids is critical. Because I’m not coming in to say, “You’re going to do it my way or else, kid.” I’m going to say, “You’re going to do it my way if you want to get better.” – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • So the kid says to me, “You know what? I’m not really interested.” “Bummer for you. Bad choice. I guess you get to go to Mom Connie’s and practice more, because you’re not ready for therapy.” …I give kids that option. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • “Mom and Dad, are you going to continue to live like this? “Absolutely not….We’ll figure out a place where I can love you from a distance.” – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • Because I will take a kid who doesn’t want to do therapy and I say, “You’re fired.” Now, do I send the kid away, or the session’s over? No. I have him sitting in the room, away from us. Bring the parents in, and we talk about what it’s like to live with this kid. “Johnny just quit in therapy. He’s not interested in your family.” And then we’re doing cross-talk about it, and say, “Yah. I’ve been living with a kid like this. I don’t know if he wants us.” In the meantime, his ears are this big. And he might start crying. Or he might get more angry….Now he’s more vulnerable. Not mom and dad. Mom and dad are feeling more empowered. So mom and dad come out of that session feeling good. And the kid’s feeling pretty crappy. Makes sense to me. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”


— Compliance Training —

  • So they’re learning how to do “go, sit, come, stay” on the parents’ terms. Isn’t that what little kids learn? Toddlers learn that. Now the kid’s ten; he’s got some catching up to do. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • [Y]ou have to treat the attachment disorder, so that they’ll be more compliant to do the neurodevelopmental protocols. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • “Maybe you’ll get better in spite of yourself. Maybe you’ll like having parents be in charge of the family. Maybe you’ll like putting a smile on their face by doing simple things like, ‘Mom, I swept the kitchen floor really good. And you’re proud of me, and I’m proud of me.’ Because our payoff for these kids is what? Having a family. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”


— Institute for Attachment and Child Development: More Methods —

  • [W]e are real thankful to have Dr. Alston as part of the team….The psychiatric evaluation at our center – it’s about an hour and a half. [Alston] doesn’t interview the kid more than maybe five minutes. Why’s that? Kid lies, charming. Right?…[Alston is] going to pull the symptoms out from the parents and also he’s also going to pull it out from the history. And so he just kind of sees the kid and says, “Good luck. You’re going to start this new medicine.” Basically. That’s also why we can do our assessment by distance. We don’t have to see our clients to diagnose. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • So as we’re going through. We’re about the third day. Dr. Alston’s already seen the kid. If he starts him on medicine, he may be kind of aggressive to get the kid up to the level we need to get. So we’re counting on the medicine kicking in if he needs it. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • Dr. Alston is an expert in differential diagnosis with abused and neglected children. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • In Dr. Alston’s research he’s finding in the…abuse and neglect population, he’s postulating nearly 60% of those kids suffer from some form of a mood disorder. And they’re being misdiagnosed over and over again in that area. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • In August, 1998 I attended SAMONAS (Spectral Activated Music of Optimal Natural Structure) Sound Therapy Training in Ogden, Utah sponsored by The National Academy of Child Development.... They see several kids suffering from autism, Downs Syndrome, and all kinds of developmental delays with wonderful results. The Attachment Center at Evergreen can now integrate the neurodevelopmental treatment protocols of NACD and Sound Therapy with children suffering from Attachment Disorder. It's exciting because it's cost effective and could possibly fill the neurological deficits of the kids we see. – “Samonas Sound Therapy,” by Forrest Lien, MSW, Adoption.com. [accessed 28 Dec 2011].


— Dismissing Standard Therapy —

[A]cademia is way behind as far as understanding these children. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • The problem with working with traditional psychotherapy with these kids is they don't care about you.  – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”


— Attachment (“Needs”) Cycle —

  • SLIDE:  "Attachment Cycles - 1st Year – Necessary Ingredients of development of basic trust and attachment:  Eye Contact, Food, Motion, Touch, Verbal Contact, Emotional Contact, smiles…” – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • SLIDE:  "Causes - any of the following conditions put a child at high risk of developing an attachment disorder.  The critical period is from conception to
    about twenty-six months of age. 
    Genetic predisposition
    Maternal ambivalence toward pregnancy
    Traumatic prenatal experience, in utero exposure to
    alcohol/drugs
    Birth trauma…
    Undiagnosed and/or painful illness, such as colic or
    ear infections  – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • So attachment...first year about needs.  Meet the needs and the child relaxes or get soothed and the Trust Cycle is on its way...  It happens, minutes, hours, every single day.  They develop an internal sense of object permanency, as we call it in psychology terms.  I have an internal, loving image of mother in my heart.  Now, I'm 51 years old and I still want to please my mom....I got that object permanence. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”


— “Body Memory” —

  • They have a body memory of the abuse and neglect. And they have a cognitive memory of the abuse and neglect. They remember, and their bodies remember. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • If the kid’s in my lap and he starts to get triggered by the story. Now his body’s all over the place. I’m going to be in tuned to that body memory and anxiety right there. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • He says, “I’m scared of what you’re telling me, and I’m scared of what you’re going to tell me next.” “Thanks for putting words to that. I appreciate it because I can see it in your body.” – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”


— Parenting —

  • [W]e train the parents how to parent them like Konnie does, just like you would parent a toddler. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • What do toddlers do then?  Have a temper tantrum. What are they trying to do? … Get you to back off on your rules.  Discipline and control equal love and nurture in a safe, loving way. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”


— Stuck Development —

  • Now do you think that an infant who doesn't trust can do the toddler stage? No.  We have to unstuck...unstick these kids.  We have to go back and reparent them.  I've worked with 56, 60-year-old men who got their development delayed and they're still at that age – a toddler. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

  • So if we talk about getting kids unstuck from their developmental delays, don’t we have to recreate what they need to be able to accomplish those developmental stages, right? So when you take a kid who’s been in abuse and neglect…and now I’m saying, “Give up the control, kid.” Now are they going to fight… – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”


— More Dubious Claims —

  • So how do you open up the heart?  How do you wake up the brain?  Stimulate the brain….Holding a child in therapy stimulates the brain, the limbic system primarily, because touch sends a signal to the brain. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • Cause and effecting thinking based on survival, not how do I please you and be in relationship with you.  – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”


— Forced Age Regression —

  • Just because they’re ten – a lot of times they’re operating as a toddler. So developmentally, we have to catch them up. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • What do we do emotionally with kids?  We have a ten-year-old who's been through this horrendous history. Is acting out.  Do you treat that kid as a
    toddler?  Or an infant?  No.  We treat him as a ten-year-old.  – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • So we’ve got that kid now in toddler stage. We keep him in the box as long as he needs to. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”

— Endorsements —

  • Nancy Verrier is going to be our keynote speaker this year.  She wrote the book called The Primal Wound. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • There's a book called the Secret Life of the Unborn Child by Thomas Verney... He was a Canadian researcher.  Studied the effects of attachment in utero.  It's a really interesting book to understand how attachment starts in utero– From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • NACD.org…what they’re doing is a functional analysis…They taught him how to crawl. Eye exercises… – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”


— On His Background —

  • I was still in my, finishing my graduate work.  I had to go to this workshop.  It was a child development class, and it was on Attachment Disorder.  This was in 1982....I heard about this kook coming to talk about this Attachment Therapy stuff.   I heard about the media, the people who hold kids and make them mad and all that stuff. I didn't want to go….[He] shows this video tape of this kid in his arms, this therapist.  This kid is flailing his arms, kicking and screaming, calling him every foul name in the book.  And what am I thinking?  What's he doing to that kid?  He's hurting that kid.  I got a knot in my stomach. [He] brought the kid in who was on the video tape.  He's now four years older.... He says, "Dr. Cline was the first therapist who was not afraid of my mad." …  So I listened.  I got excited.  And I said this is what I want to learn about. – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • Back in 1983, I convinced my faculty supervisor to get to take one of these kids to Colorado with one of these foster moms who said, "I want to adopt this kid, but I'm not going to adopt him like this."  Makes sense, doesn't it?  Why would you adopt a predator, if you knew it?  – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”
  • Went to work for the Casey Family Program….That's where I got my training to do this work, Attachment Therapy.  Took me two years of training to do this.  – From "Saving Children, Saving Families, Saving Lives.”